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Kaberle deadline weekend

With the hockey sports world centered in Toronto, everyone and their uncle (at least those who are not fixated on other sports or enjoying their summer) are speculating about what will happen regarding  D Tomas Kaberle.  Kaberle has window in his No Trade Clause that closes at midnight tonight midnight Sunday, and Toronto Maple Leafs GM Brian Burke has made it no secret that he is shopping the 32 year old veteran. 

Kaberle is a puck-moving defenseman, which is makes him someone that should fit in Guy Boucher's system.

Damian Cristordero at the Times stoked the fires of the Kaberle and TB yesterday.  Ryan Malone was the key player mentioned in that story.

Some of our own  members have been calling for a deal since the Gagne acquisition...  That being said, I'm putting up a poll to gauge fan interest in a Lightning acquisition of Kaberle.  

[Note by John Fontana, 08/14/10 1:19 PM EDT ] Got the timing wrong on the close to the Kaberle NTC window.  Thanks to Mike Gallimore for correcting me.

[Note by John Fontana, 08/15/10 10:03 PM EDT ] Maybe the biggest revelation in chatter about the Kaberle trade talk is not a Kaberle matter directly.  It's the reports via Twitter that LW Ryan Malone has a No Trade / No Movement clause in his contracft.  This stipulation had not been public knowledge until tonight.  

Poll
Should the Lightning acquire D Tomas Kaberle? At what cost?
Yes! Whatever it takes!
87 votes
Yes, but only if the costs are low / expendable bit players
78 votes
No.
23 votes
Who is Tomas Kaberle? When are the Lightning bringing back Enrico Ciccone?!
10 votes

198 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 25 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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I'll weigh in again...

If the Lightning do acquire Kaberle, it shock me if Malone wasn’t moved and, no matter how much I like the guy and think he fits now, knowing that a) he’s going to be expendable sooner rather than later and b) his departure would probably ensure at least one of Gagne and Kaberle are extended.

It’s easy to dismiss Malone for Kaberle as undesirable trade-off, but when you consider the larger picture of what Yzerman has accomplished this summer, you can see that Gagne and whoever is chosen to round out the top-6 will more than likely at least match last year’s contributions from Malone and those that filled in (i.e. Tanguay, Halpern, etc.). Then factor in the upgrades to the lower lines and defensive corps, a revitalized PK and probably at least the status quo on the PP, you might realize there probably wouldn’t be much need to lament Malone after all.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 14, 2010 12:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Didn't finish the first paragraph...

“and, no matter…are extended”, makes me wiling to accept the mere possibility of heading back in a trade for Kaberle.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 14, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

if malone goes?

who will round out the top 6? i know percell was put in that spot last year but he really didnt do a good job. perhaps connolly if he surprises people in camp? or maybe another addition? how bout one of these guys? fedotenko, lehtinen, stempniak, svatos? and what about getting asham for the 3rd line? asham, moore, and pouliot could be a good combo.

by TomK91 on Aug 14, 2010 1:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Malone is a LW, Purcell is a RW, as is Connolly

And you might want to flesh out what a “Good job” is, because considering the circumstances — no one was going to come in and do a “good job” in the dysfunctional system in Tampa where the coaches fueded, the GM and coach feuded, and there was no clear system besides “Give Stamkos the puck”

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 14, 2010 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

well arent gagne and malone both listed as LWs? yet everyone is saying they are going to be on a line with vinny…. and Downie and Marty are both listed as RW yet they play on the same line…. i dont think wings make that much of a difference. unless theres a problem with which hand the guy is shooting. wouldnt having connolly as RW vinny C and gagne LW work fine?

by TomK91 on Aug 14, 2010 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Connolly will be going back to juniors.

I would imagine Purcell would be given first crack to play with Vinny and Gagne/St. Louis. Next in line, barring a UFA signing would probably be Harju. From there is more of a crapshoot, with a deserving kid who has a great camp (Ashton, Tyrell) getting an opportunity.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 14, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm pretty sure Purcell saw some action at LW...

…but I could be mistaken.

But, yes, he’ s a natural RW.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 14, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

For Kaberle

And if you trade Malone, who’s going to provide a net front presence on the power supply? Pronger and Chara will be in Vinny and Stamkos’ face all night if Malone isn’t there. Downie is much more expendable than Malone as he will be a 3rd liner in a year or 2.

Don in St Pete

by Don in St Pete on Aug 14, 2010 11:46 PM EDT reply actions  

Probably the most bold take on Downie that someone has come out and said, Don. And I guess the question is really: What is Steve Downie’s role ont he Tampa Bay Lightning, long term?

Maloen has his role defined, as you lay it out. Downie… Is he a scoring wing or a pest? Can he excel in the Theo Fleury mold?

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

You have to ask the same thing about Malone, though. If Downie is an eventual 3rd liner pending the emergence of developing talent like Brett Connolly and Richard Panik, you have to think Malone’s on borrowed time in the top-6 until Carter Ashton (the closest to NHL-ready) is on the big club and ready for a larger role.

But yes, with Malone, what you see is what you get. Downie, however, has just begun tapping the offensive potential that he possesses. Aside from size, there’s really not any facets of the game that you can give Malone a clear advantage in. Both are very similar, IMO, despite their difference in stature in many areas except perhaps the most crucial: skating. Downie has the definitive edge there.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 15, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

You forget the other intangible working against Downie

Powder keg / reckless. One season playing without major incident (and I think we all were more entertained by his major incident this season — riling up Ovi) doesn’t mean he’s cured. It’s te biggest liability of his game — his hair trigger temper. He doesn’t have Rick Tocchet grooming him anymore either.

It’s a sink-or-swim season. The promise is there, but it could go exactly as Don sees it.

For the money, Malone in a 3rd line role is expendable. But overvaluing a historically reckless/ill-tempered player who is not an enforcer… He has to be more consistent in what he did last season and prove that’s the player he is… Not the attack-my-teammate-for-forgoing-hazing nut-job.

Regardless. I think both guys are safe in trade talks with Toronto. Everyone – including Burke – is saying the offers coming in are crap, and getting a top-6 forward is not going to happen in a deal for Kaberle.

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I, too, doubt Tampa will actually acquire Kaberle, but I cannot support the notion that this is a “sink-or-swim” season for Downie, who’s versatile enough to play anywhere in the lineup. Given that he’s 24 and going to remain quite affordable for at least several more years, I think it’s a pretty safe bet to suggest he’s part of the team’s “core”, unlike Malone.

His past antics are well-documented and certainly gave reason to hold your breath during certain stretches of the past two seasons, and he definitely benefited from Tochhet’s stewardship, but, call me crazy, I don’t find myself that worried about him. I think skating with Stamkos and St. Louis/Gagne and seeing significant PP time will do plenty to keep him reasonably focused. I also wouldn’t discount Boucher’s academic background and how that reputedly translates to his management of players. I do understand your point, though.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 15, 2010 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Interesting take.

I do agree that it’s a choice between Malone or Downie, but I will stand by the prevalent thought that Malone would be the logical choice to trade between the two. First, because of his contract. Second, because I’m not sold on the idea that the Lightning’s PP would wither in Malone’s absence. I was intrigued enough to do some “research”:

In the 13 games they were without Malone, the Lightning PP went 8-43. That’s an 18% clip. The Bolts went 60-283, or a 21% conversion rate in the 69 games Malone was in the lineup. On the surface, the idea of Malone’s net presence being irreplaceable seems to hold some weight, but a 3% difference isn’t drastic an if you dig further you find Malone himself had 7 PP goals, roughly 10% of the Lightning’s season total on the PP, but Steve Downie managed 7 PP goals, too.

More crucial, obviously, was Stamkos’ 24 PPG, or 35% of the team’s total. Obviously there’s no way to quantify exactly how many Stamkos rockets were helped by Malone parked in front, but 5 of the 8 PP goals the Lightning scored in Malone’s absence were by Stamkos. Downie was on the ice and playing Malone’s role for 4 of those 5 goals. Maybe if I had a lot of extra time I could go back and look at all of Stamkos’, Malone’s and Downie’s PP goals but I don’t, so my best guess is a Malone-less Lightning would, at worst, experience a slight dip in their PP performance.

by Michael Gallimore on Aug 15, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

mike you missed our roller game this morning retard……

i would gladly trade downie and a 3rd and maybe smaby or downie and smaby for kaberle all day long. downie will be gone in a year or two with all the talent we have in the minors anyway. why not get kaberle while we still can? and resign him to like a 3 yr deal.

by TomK91 on Aug 15, 2010 1:29 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Lyle Richardson (AKA Spector) just tweeted:
For those keeping score, Detroit, Dallas & Anaheim are definitely not in the bidding for Kaberle.

Dallas was never a true candidate when you think about it. Ownership in flux, sale stuff ongoing. The team cannot add or subtract significant payroll until things are nearly finalized. 4 Million a year is significant payroll.

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 5:22 PM EDT reply actions  

Darren Dreger Tweeted earlier this hour

http://twitter.com/DarrenDreger/statuses/21271143550

One team from each conference still in the hunt for Kaberle. Sources say there’s still a chance he gets traded tonight, but not likely.

Using deduction from Mike Corcoran’s observations, it’s SJ and TB (or TB and another western conference team) in the hunt.

Could be completely wrong here.

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 8:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Size matters

Does anyone else remember how Philly pushed the Habs around in the EC finals last season and shut them out 3 times? Take away Malone and V4 is the only top 6 forward over 6’1". I like Downie and love his game but Tyrell, Connolly and Panik are probably all more skilled. Malone will also be an odd man out in a couple years but in the meantime you have his big body, big mitts and a veteran presence who’s been to the cup finals. I’d rather keep both and hope our d can do the job, but I trust that Yzerman will only make a move that’sin the best long and short term interest of the Bolts. He could trade Malone and bring in Owen Nolan on a 1 year deal to provide some size, muscle and in close goal scoring prowess.

Don in St Pete

by Don in St Pete on Aug 15, 2010 9:13 PM EDT reply actions  

Revelation via Twitter that Ryan Malone has a NM/NT clause in his contract. Has not been asked to waive it as of 9 PM EDT

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 10:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Any word on what it is (what constraints it places)?

by MTBoltFan on Aug 16, 2010 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

That'll come out today in reports

This totally blindsided everyone. No one knew about it (TB fans, Capgeek and official sources, other media). No conditions or terms were divulged besides the fact it was there.

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 16, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

Malone

Andy Strickland is reporting that Tampa is making a major bid for Kaberle with Malone as the centerpiece. 9:15 update on Mike Augello’s blog at Hockeybuzz per Strickland.

Don in St Pete

by Don in St Pete on Aug 15, 2010 10:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Malone has a NTC

Word is Malone has refused to waive his NTC for Toronto at this time.

Don in St Pete

by Don in St Pete on Aug 15, 2010 10:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Conflicting reports on that.

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Less than 40 minutes

Burnside reported nothing is going to happen “Barring a miracle” a little while ago.

"Seen Cincuenta" -- 04.10.10 -- Raw Charge.

by John Fontana on Aug 15, 2010 11:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Good Riddance

I’m not sure Burke was ever going to get what he wanted for Kaberle, given the depth of the defensemen available this off-season. I think he wanted something similar to what he gave Boston for Kessel—and no one was willing to give him that given the economics of the time.

That said, I would have liked to have seen Kaberle on our blueline but—like in the lead-up to the Gagne trade—was concerned about what we’d have to give up in return. I am glad to see the Bolts’ front office practicing what they preached from the beginning: patience.

by MTBoltFan on Aug 16, 2010 9:39 AM EDT reply actions  

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