Game 39: Tampa Bay Lightning at Ottawa Senators
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 8:31 AM EST
in '11-'12 game recaps
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PrintThe Tampa Bay Lightning lost to the Ottawa Senators 4-1.
Despite the score, this was actually a pretty good game for the Lightning. They put out a full 60-minute effort, and they played well. The score was more a reflection of how Craig Anderson played in net for the Senators than how the Lightning played. And also not a bad showing, considering they were playing with two fewer forwards than usual for the last two periods of the game.
They were much improved from the previous game on most fronts. There were only two major stats that the Lightning didn't lead in all night. The big one was the score, of course. The not-as-big one was faceoffs.
Most of the Lightning centers struggled to win faceoffs in the defensive zone. The lone exception was Dominic Moore, who won three of four (75%). The neutral zone wasn't much better for them, either. Yes, there is some strategy involved in faceoffs; there are situations where you ‘lose' a faceoff in order to accomplish what you want. But that sort of thing typically doesn't apply to the defensive zone.
The bottom line is that it's sort of difficult to have control of the puck in the defensive zone if the offense has it immediately from the faceoff. If the opposing team has control of the puck, then it allows them to shoot on your goalie. Funny how that works, isn't it.
Dwayne Roloson had a fairly good game, for the most part. The first goal he allowed wasn't very pretty, and probably should've been dealt with differently. However, outside of that one significant problem, he was pretty solid in net. Definitely a confidence booster for him, regardless of the score.
Steven Stamkos scored his league-leading 28th goal of the season halfway through the third and made it 2-1. He currently has a five game goal scoring streak, scoring eight goals in those five games. He was set up by a fantastic play made by Vincent Lecavalier.
The downside of the game (other than the score) was that the Lightning lost both Adam Hall and J.T. Wyman in the first. They both have upper body injuries - Wyman, reportedly, was slashed across the hand. They will likely be re-evaluated today in Montreal. The Lightning now have six players injured as of the end of this game: Hall (upper body), Wyman (upper body), Ryan Malone (lower body), Ryan Shannon (sprained knee), Victor Hedman (concussion), and Mattias Ohlund (knees).
A bright spot is that Brett Connolly will be rejoining the team in Montreal after helping Canada win the bronze medal at the World Junior Hockey Championships in Calgary. (Sweden won gold, Russia got silver.) He may be in the lineup, depending on how Hall and Wyman are doing.
They played a much more disciplined game than they did previously, and that was good to see. As well as get more shots. The odd stat of the night was that Matt Gilroy had seven shots on goal, which was one more than Stamkos. Gilroy is considered an offensive-defenseman, but even that's a little over the top. Also good to see, however.
The next game is Saturday, 7 January, at the Montreal Canadiens. Game time is 7 pm ET. The Raw Charge game thread will be available at 6:30 pm - please join us.
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Yeah, the score didn't reflect the Lightning's good play
It’s too bad for them that Anderson woke up that morning and thought he was 2009-10 Anderson again.
Frustrating loss.
It was one of their better efforts in recent games, weirdly enough. I’m choosing to view it as the Universe evening up the Bolts for their 5-1 win over Philly a bit ago…
Last night:
Philly game:
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
I still think the Philly game is completely overblown
the Flyers did not dominate, shot totals be damned.
And anyways, with as bad as our luck has been over November and December (see: Clare’s chart from a couple days ago), I don’t think any evening is required.
But I will say that I’m getting very close to the point where I’m giving up on wins and just hoping to see play that makes me hopeful for next year.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
Yzerman talked with some Vancouver radio station last night, and he was saying that there wasn’t much for him to do right now. He doesn’t want to give up prospects or high draft picks, and that’s all other teams are asking for. So we’re stuck with what there is, pretty much. If I have some time, I’ll see if there’s a transcript on it. And if there isn’t, I could probably type up a transcript of it tonight or tomorrow.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
I think the Wild and the Bolts might come to terms on a mutually beneficial deal – the Wild are carrying a few extra defenseman, have a relatively solid goalie in Harding, but need serious help scoring.
The Bolts could use a decent defenseman and goalie, right? I’m thinking Harding and one of Lundin/Zanon for Malone or something similar might go down and make both teams happy.
"90% of the game is physical. The other half is mental." - Yogi Berra
Yzerman said flat out—there are no goalies available that are any better than Matthieu and Dwayne. Ergo, Harding isn’t available.
Malone has a NMC, but lots of folks would love to get Lundin back.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Harding might become available
I think that Fletcher is starting to get antsy as the Wild keep spiraling out of control (i’m a Wild fan). We have started to hear rumblings that he is now active in trade talks (to whom, I have no idea). And Zanon and Lundin have both been healthy scratches in recent games in the last few weeks. We also have a decent call-up in Matt Hackett (had an under 2 GAA and 97% save percentage in the two games he played this year) that could potentially back-up Backstrom. I would love to see Harding and Lundin/Zanon for Malone, plus a swap of some picks. I think it would be mutually beneficial. We definitely NEED a top six power forward. But there are a lot of “ifs” to the scenario (first would be if Malone is willing to waive his NTC), so it would be hard to figure out. Though I would say the Wild and Lightning do seem like perfect trade partners. At least that is what I would do in NHL ’11…
There’s a very small window for TB right now. If nothing gets done in the next couple of weeks, and the Bolts keep losing as much as they have been, there’s a very low chance of anything getting done until this summer. Yzerman might trade prospects, but he won’t trade picks, and I don’t know how willing he is to think about trading key players like Malone. (Although I can only think of 4 players who are absolutely and unconditionally off the table.)
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Four players? I'm curious...who?
I’ve only got two on my list right now.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
Vinny, Marty, Stamkos, and Hedman
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Yeah, I only have Stammer and Hedman on my list.
St. Louis isn’t untradeable, but he’s probably close because I’d ask for way more in return than people would give.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
There is zero chance that Yzerman lets Martin St. Louis leave unless Martin St. Louis requests it. He is the heart and soul of this team. He is the identity of the Lightning and he should retire a Bolt.
(And he has a NMC.)
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Yeah, exactly...I love St. Louis and I don't want him to go.
I’m just saying, from a FO point of view, Yzerman should at least be willing to listen on him. It’s always good to keep options open, even if the potential of anything happening is miniscule.
Then again, that’s how I approach every sport…I don’t think anyone on the Rays in untradeable, outside of Longoria and Moore at the moment. Some players just have a much higher likelihood of getting dealt than others.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
He won’t trade highly drafted prospects unless it’s a very sweet deal.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
That's why I said Malone
I think he is the ONLY one that Yzerman would trade.
I tend to agree
but he’d have to save the NMC.
If Downie and Purcell were having better years, they’d be nice trade bait. There’s a lot of potential there, but they both started out very, very slowly.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
I think that Bugsy’s more important to the team than some folks think. And it’s not completely because he’s utterly adorable. I think he brings size, grit, and leadership and is more key to the workings of the team than it might look at first glance. And also that he’s utterly adorable.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
That's why I like him for the Wild
The size and grit, that go along with the skill… Not so much the adorable part, though that’s not a bad thing…
As far as Downie and Purcell are concerned, the Wild already have multiple of those players – Purcell=Bouchard/Cullen, Downie=Clutterbuck/Brodziak/Johnson/Setoguchi. They might be nice trade bait for another team, but I don’t think the Wild will be interested.
You’re right. The things that I value in Bugsy’s game are the things that make him attractive to other teams. I don’t have a clue where he fits into Yzerman’s thinking.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
If only we knew what he was thinking and the conversations he has with other GM’s. Then we wouldn’t have a 400 post thread to keep us busy with hours of speculation…
Agree
The disposable “gritty” player is Downie.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
the problem
is our disposable players aren’t desirable players
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:56 PM EST up reply actions
Wyman, Tyrell, Hall, Bergeron, Clark, Connolly, Moore, Pyatt, Brewer, Gervais, Gilroy—all moveable, all with something to offer.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
are Connolly and Brewer that much more disposable than Malone?
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:00 PM EST up reply actions
Hmm...I'd be very indisposed to trading away Connolly unless we got a haul.
Top draft pick, young, cheap….that’s tough to beat.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
agree on all counts
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
that’s a huge part of his value. I wouldn’t like to see it happen, but the kid is moveable and desirable.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
I mean if we get a top five pick that's also young and is a defenseman or goalie
yeah
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
Top 5 goalie or defensemen picks are rare. And Luongo-esque.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
I don't really mean he had to be a top five pick
but that kind of quality
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
The thing is, Connolly is the sort of player the Bolts should be trying to acquire in a trade right now.
So trading him away is a bit backwards.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
To me there are more holes on the back end than the front end.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
while this is true
two of the best on the front end are on the wrong side of 30
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah.
I’m also greedy with young players and don’t like to trade them away. It’s the Rays fan in me.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
I didn’t say he shouldn’t be sold high. But he is both moveable and desirable and if you two are going to force me to accept thinking about moving core players, I’m going to force you to contemplate moving kids.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Fair, the trick is getting a fair value in return.
Prospect for prospect swaps don’t happen very often, and if a prospie is getting shopped, most teams assume that’s because there’s something wrong with them.
If the Bolts could get a comparable talent to Connolly but on defense…I’d hesitate, but possibly do it. Dunno what the odds of that happening are, though.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 2:24 PM EST up reply actions
/Justin Faulk man-crush
//not happening
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 2:28 PM EST up reply actions
The Wild
Have a few who I would think are comparables. But i would hate to depart with them. But we need scorers.
if both teams hate to depart with their guys
it’s probably a fair trade
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
if a prospie is getting shopped, most teams assume that’s because there’s something wrong with them
Not necessarily. Prospects with value can be turned into assets quite readily. Off the top of my head, I’m thinking of Nashville’s reputation as a “goalie factory” and the way that Lindback, Smith, and to a lesser extent Dekanich have all been considered trade assets first and future Preds second.
If a prospect/young player can bring something back, he’s an asset.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
I figured that would be the case. OK Hockey did us no favors, in the hopes of short term gain at the expense of long-term quality. We’re paying for that now.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
Yep. As Erlendsson said on Twitter last night, it’s short-term pain for long-term gain. That’s going to be the story.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
...and needs to be.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
So we all just need to suck it up and accept that to be how it is.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
I'm a Tennessee fan
I’ve been on this bandwagon for at least four years. and I’m extremely sick of it, whether or not it’s correct
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I've begun looking toward the future.
Need a bit more time to coalesce my thoughts, but I should have something for Monday. But right now, I’m leaning towards the Bolts selling at the deadline and I’m afraid they won’t do it.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
Sell what, though?
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Vinny.
#waitsfortheexplosion
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
Now you're playing with fire.
This could be fun to watch.
#marshmallowroastingtime
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
Suuuuure. Mm-hmm. I’ll just be sitting over here holding my breath for that one.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Yeah, and that's why I'm afraid it won't happen.
But for the long term health of the franchise, he needs to be dealt…and the sooner the better, really. Either that or have his contract restructured, but I don’t see that happening.
Like I said, I’m putting together something for Monday. It’s weird to say, but the Bolts could have a considerably better team without him.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
A, NMC
B. $10 million a year. Until 2016. No one’s gonna take on that contract. It’s unmoveable.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Eh, I wouldn't be so sure of that.
Some of the larger market teams could be willing to take it on…there were rumors about Vinny as recent as last year’s trade deadline. But if we wait too much longer, that contract is going to become unmoveable and it’s going to drag the entire franchise down for years and year to come. Not to mention, having Vinny off the books will make it that much easier to resign Stammer when his current contract lets up.
Think about how much $10m can buy you on the FA market. Not only would the Bolts be getting back something in return for Vinny, but having the ability to reallocate that money to improving the team elsewhere would be incredible.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
I tend to agree here
even though Vinny is way more important than 99% of the “trade Vinny now!” people think he is, unless he assures us that he’s going to hang up his skates long before his contract actually runs out, he’s more harm than good in the long-term. Thanks a bunch, OK Hockey. With any reasonable contract, I could look forward to one of our 2004 heroes finishing his career in Tampa.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
It'd be one thing if the Bolts were in contention this year and looking strong.
But with the current holes on this team and the very small chance of making a playoff run, yeah, I don’t see how it can’t be on the table.
Vinny’s definitely still a really good player, and he’s having a helluva year. That’s one of the main reasons I think now should be the time to deal him…I doubt his value will be any higher at any point in the future.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
sell high sucks sometimes
but it’s smart
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
I think you’re both deluding yourselves on the Vinny front. Unless the salary structure goes way up to make that contract more attractive to a team trying to get to the floor (a la Florida this summer), no one’s going to take it. And even then, he has a NMC. The possibility is vanishingly small, IMO.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
There's a difference between saying it's unlikely to happen and saying it shouldn't happen.
I dunno what the likelihood of it is in the end — the NMC is rough, and breaking it to Vinny would be awkward no matter what — but it’s something the FO should be looking into and discussing. Otherwise they’re not doing their due diligence.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:14 PM EST up reply actions
There is absolutely no chance—say it again, no chance—Vinny voids his NMC. How much money has he put into the community? Nobody puts as much in to the local community as much as Vinny if they want to leave.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
There’s also a respect issue involved, too. He’s not the kind of guy you just ditch – not after what he’s done with the community and how he’s committed to the team over the years. The Lightning hasn’t exactly been a winning team the entire time he’s been around, and he could’ve tested the free agent market.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
yep
I’d considered this also. but I hope he can repay the respect not to shop him by hanging it up when it’s time
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:05 PM EST up reply actions
I’m sure he would, or at least I think he would. Vinny doesn’t strike me as the kind of guy that hangs on just for the sake of staying in the NHL. There are no guarantees of course, but I think Vinny will hang it up at the appropriate time and not hang on just to try to milk that contract.
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:50 PM EST up reply actions
I said elsewhere in this thread
that I don’t think it happens, for the reasons you suggest. But if we could do it, especially now while his value is high, it’d likely be worth doing
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
Realistically, the guy’s off the table. For all practical purposes. I’d rather focus on figuring out what kind of return other guys could get than speculating on getting rid of Vinny. Might as well start dreaming about bringing in Nik Lidstrom and Jimmy Howard, because that’s just about as likely.
There are 18 other players more likely to be moved than Vinny. To me, it’s a lot more interesting to consider what kind of return they would net than to dream about Vinny’s $10 million suddenly being free.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
for practical purposes
our discussion doesn’t matter. And I’m sure SY is listening to all the offers he’s getting, whether about Vinny, Bugsy, Gilory, or Carter Ashton
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
speaking of which
we just traded Blair Jones
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
for Brendan Mikkelson
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
Who is Brendan Mikkelson?
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
defenseman from Calgary
splitting time between Calgary and their AHL. Second round pick two years ago. Hockey futures says he’s very good with the puck but needs to learn to be calm in his own end when under pressure
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:36 PM EST up reply actions
So, the exact kind of Dman Yzerman and Boucher seem to love..
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
pretty much
and I messed up, he was drafted 6 years ago, not two.
we essentially just traded a 4th round forward from 2005 for a 2nd round defenseman in 2005
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
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by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
If you don't move Vinny's contract, you're just pushing furniture around.
Think about this: for the 2014 season, the Bolts have $26m in cap space…..but they only have 7 players signed to contracts. Seven! How can the Bolts put together any sort of competitive team if they have to flesh out their roster on that sort of budget?
The Bolts can probably put a competitive-ish team together for the next couple years, but after that, I don’t see a lot of hope unless they bring in some more youth and free up that money in Vinny’s deal.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
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by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe so, but it’s so unlikely that I can’t really be interested in the speculation. To my mind that’s just a contract that has to be worked around. It sucks, but it’s still there.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Actually, that's kinda funny....the 2014 scenario is technically the same for next year too.
The Bolts have so much money locked up in a handful of players…it makes the whole depth thing kinda tough.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
I'd take contract restructured in a heartbeat
if that doesn’t happen, I’m afraid we’re stuck. We’re not trading him, and he’s on our books for another eight years
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
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by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Under the current CBA, player contracts cannot be restructured. Once it’s signed and delivered, it’s final.
The 10 million number is always tossed around in reference to Vinny’s contract. While that is the amount of dollars out, his cap hit is 7.727 mil. His contract is front loaded. During the later years of the contract his salary drops.
I think it’s important to remember that Vinny didn’t ask for that kind of money. There was no hold out, no bickering, no true negotiating. The contract was offered and Vinny took it. Why wouldn’t he?
While his contract is cumbersome, I don’t believe it’s the teams worst. Take a look at the contract given to Mattias Ohlund. He’s now 35 years old and may never play an NHL game again. His cap hit is 3.6 mil and he’s on the books for 4 more seasons after this one. Ryan Malone’s contract is no bargain either.
With players salaries what they are, I have to look at the lockout season and wonder what the hell we lost a year of games for? The owners didn’t budge on their demand for a salary cap to protect themselves from themselves. Since that CBA went into effect player salaries have increased every year to an all time high.
And the owners won?
Not are players salaries at an all time level, this is the only professional sports league where a players salary is guaranteed for it’s duration. The NFL allows renegotiated contract and by simply cutting a player negates the contract. I’ve heard that that is a point the owners want to address in the upcoming CBA discussions. It could be an interesting off season.
If the team wanted to trade Vinny and he accepted the idea, which I don’t think will happen, I believe several teams would be more than willing to take on his contract . The only thing making Vinny untradeable is himself.
I think he’s going to be here for a long time. Steve Y will have to work around the contracts that he inherited.
by Slip Mahoney on Jan 6, 2012 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
nobody's blaming Vinny
but that doesn’t make it suck any less
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
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by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
"The only thing making Vinny untradeable is himself."
Yeah, exactly…I have no idea how receptive he would be to the idea. That’s the real kicker to the situation, but in my mind, it’s the only thing preventing it from happening.
But it’s very rare that a player absolutely refuses to get traded at all…normally once its talked over, there are at least a handful of places they would be willing to go. Maybe Vinny is one of the few, but SY won’t find out until he talks with him about it.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
Nothing says “sucks to be the GM” than having a player with a cap hit of $7.727M, but only paying the player $1M.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
I can’t imagine Vinny will be getting much joy out of being told by the fans that he needs to go, either.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:06 PM EST up reply actions
nobody with any sense thinks Vinny needs to go
everybody thinks Vinny’s cap hit will become a problem. I can’t imagine him being offended at hearing that
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, I understand that. But it’s starting already. People are saying now that Vinny needs to go because he’s not worth the contract. And it’s only going to get worse.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
You are absolutely correct Cassie. Once it starts …… it snowballs.
From what I’ve been told, and i can’t say this is absolute truth, the owners want to limit the guaranteed money to 2 yrs, have the ability to renegotiate long term deals after those 2 years, and limit the term length of contracts. Once again to protect themselves from themselves.
Should that happen, I believe Vinny would welcome a restructuring to stay here. It’s my opinion that coming to a conclusion about this team, and Vinny, should wait until the new environment is known.
I think renegotiation needs to be an option. But, having said that, I think that there ought to be a significant monetary penalty involved for whoever initiates the process so that it’s not abused. Because I can see teams still signing guys to outrageous contracts to keep them off the open market with plans to renegotiate in a year or two.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:31 PM EST up reply actions
And vice versa. The last thing our sport needs is another Drew Rosenhaus.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
Yep – which is why I said “whoever” initiates the process, and not “teams” that initiate the process. :o)
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
“Because I can see teams still signing guys to outrageous contracts to keep them off the open market with plans to renegotiate in a year or two.”
That happens in the NHL often.
I don’t see that as a bad thing. It’s good for the player, he lines his pockets for 2 years. I also see that as a good thing for owners and GM’s. I think it offers needed flexibility.
Salaries and the cap have severely limited trades in this league. I believe that having that flexibility would create more activity and that’s when the best GM’s rise to the top.
He's not worth the contract. But no one is worth that contract,
except MAYBE a healthy, never injured Sidney Crosby. And even then, it’s unlikely that that would remain true until 2020. It’s a bad contract because it’s so far out of line with market value for any player.
That said, I value VL4’s game, leadership, and presence. I don’t blame him for the contract and I want to see him stick around. But I do have to put the contract aside to be able to judge his contributions fairly.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
I agree that no one’s worth that money. And, it’s not even Vinny’s fault – he was offered that contract and took it as it was. He would’ve been a fool not to. And being injured/recovering from surgery for a couple of years didn’t help his cause much. Still, there are some seriously unreal expectations going on when it comes to him.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
That’s the reality of the salary cap world. In no other circumstance would there be discussion here of trying to move the team’s second-highest scorer. And captain.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Oh no – this would still be going on. There are some serious Vinny haters out there that are Lightning fans. Now that there’s Stamkos, it’s even worse than before. They’d use anything against him to get him off the team.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Seriously?
Well, I guess that if Preds fans can talk about how much they think Shea Weber and Pekka Rinne suck and need to be traded, it shouldn’t be surprising that people would latch onto Vinny regardless of his contract.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Yep – seriously. Sometimes I feel like I’ve spent half my time on this blog defending the guy. And I shouldn’t have to.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
some people are idiots
this is a universal truth
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
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by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
He’s not perfect, of course. No one is. But he’s certainly not as bad as a few make him out to be, either.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
Huh, didn't know that...that's rather absurd.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 2:03 PM EST up reply actions
Yup, certainly can't blame him for taking the deal.
And he’s still one helluva player…agreed there.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 2:03 PM EST up reply actions
It's not so much that he's not worth it.
He isn’t — that’s not to say he’s not a great player, but his cap hit is the second largest in the NHL — but that’s not the real problem.
The issue is his contract makes it difficult for the Bolts to put a deep team on the ice, so that is going to continue to perpetually limit how good the Bolts can be. And once he starts going downhill, that’s going to make it really tough for the Bolts to field a competitive team. If the Bolts had revenue streams like the Rangers, whatever, it’s not a problem. But they don’t.
If he’s okay with not having much of a shot at a Cup over the remainder of his contract, okay. That’s up to him.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
The way Vinny’s contract was written has him earning much less in the late years. Years that are unlikely to even played. It’s a way to soften the overall cap hit. Something that will be addressed in the next CBA.
He’ll still have a cap hit of over $7 million for the duration of his contract, no matter what he’s actually being paid.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
so as long as he goes ahead and retires once his game starts declining, we're good
if he doesn’t, that sucks
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
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by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:16 PM EST up reply actions
But how will he know the difference between a bad year and his game declining? I mean, there are people now who feel his game has seriously declined. Should he retire now? I understand what you’re saying, but it’s a difficult thing to judge.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, it's difficult to tell
it’s not now, and it’s not all the way in 2020. and if it’s a year or two late, that’s not a huge big deal, but if it drags out another 4-5 years after his game is gone. . .
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
Right – and I agree with that. Peter Forsberg was a great example. He should’ve gracefully retired years ago instead of dragging things out. Still, hindsight is 20-20.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe he plans to play until Marty is playing, for the next 3 and a half years?
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
You do realize that Vinny’s only 31 years old, right?
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
Yes. How many more years of being a 70-point player to you think he has?
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
Probably not what’s left on his contract, but a lot more than what you’re probably figuring.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
Vinny is on pace for 29-27-56 in 81 games. I wouldn’t put any money on he being still good in 4-5 years.
And I love Vinny.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
As far as the evening, my thing is that their PDO / bad luck is all coming on Goals Allowed.
They’re above league average in shot percentage, and slightly above what they averaged last season. That’s why last night struck me as somewhat encouraging, while the Philly game just made me wipe my brow.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
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by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
the thing with the Philly game
is that it was a fairly even game through two periods. We were lucky to be ahead, but it’s not like we were lucky to still be in the game.
In the third period, we had a three goal lead. There’s a reason the Fenwick rankings throw out any statistics compiled when the margin is three or greater. So they got a lot of shots and made it look like they really trounced us and got unlucky. It’s not the case.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
Good call about that.
I mean, the Bolts were still outshot pretty handily through the first two periods…but it is kinda cool to see how their three goals in a row were scored while they were dominating the puck there for awhile in the second.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, we were still outshot
but both teams had long periods of dominance. That second period was a breath of fresh air coming off San Jose and Colorado
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
How many more posts/crossbars can a team hit without scoring a goal?
Very frustrating game—even Stamkos’ goal was a bit of a fluke. Michalek had the puck at his feet and fumbled the clear, allowing Stamkos to pounce.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
I just hope this Front Office is learning from this season. That’s all.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 11:03 AM EST reply actions
My gut feeling is that this is not that far off what they expected things to be. They keep saying they knew it would be harder this season than last. I think they expected a very tough slog. And that they’re trying desperately to keep their focus on the next several years.
That’s just my feeling from the way they’ve reacted to the difficulties and things said in interviews, you understand. I don’t have any special insight or inside information or anything.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
They’re looking long term, not short term. There won’t be any quick fixes here. Not anymore – not with Yzerman.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
So who goes? Marty or Vinny? You cant keep both of those guys if your thinking long term. Im guessing Marty is more attractive.
Marty is the heart and soul of the team
I have trouble seeing him go. Vinny may’ve been the face of the franchise for the last 5-6 years, but he’s more expendable in my eyes. I’d hate to see him go, but I’d recognize the business sense if there was a good trade on the table
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
As far as I’m concerned, the price tag on Martin St. Louis is a 25-year-old Wayne Gretzky.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 12:36 PM EST up reply actions
sounds about right to me
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, are you working on a hockey time machine, too?
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
If the subject is a Martin St. Louis trade,
Yes.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
I want one to bonk Jim Balsille on the head and prevent him from selling off Paul Kariya in 2007. Among other things. I’m unsure about kidnapping 25-yr-old Gretzky, because that could upset the space-time continuum enough to prevent hockey from ever reaching the Sunbelt.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
You’re still looking for a quick fix by trading someone – I just said that probably wasn’t going to happen.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
BoltProspects on the new pickup
Mikkelson’s a good pick-up as a depth dman for a team that needs one. Skates well, isn’t physical, not a point producer. 6/7 guy.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:48 PM EST reply actions
also
What is attractive about Oberg and Mikkelson is they’re still on the low side of 25. Mikkelson’s contract ends this summer. (RFA)
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
As did Blair's contract.
Seems like a pretty fair deal all around.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Jan 6, 2012 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
yep
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Jan 6, 2012 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
(He was a DUCK. If he has issues with being “calm under pressure” he may still be a Duck.)
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
The key word there is “was”. ;o)
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
Hmph. Chris Pronger’s still a Duck.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Yeah, but it’s Pronger. :o|
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:04 PM EST up reply actions
It’s Duckitude,
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
No – it’s Pronger.
"You don't have enough talent to win on talent alone." -Herb Brooks
Raw Charge, an SBN Tampa Bay Lightning community. Follow me on Twitter: @dagmar27.
by Cassie McClellan on Jan 6, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
Who was head Duck for all that time.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Pronger defined Duckitude.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
But he was a Blue before he was a Duck. He didn’t get p!ssy until he left St Louis. He was my favorite player during his tenure there.
Now…not so much.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
Duckishness and Pronger go together for me. That “anything’s permissible as long as you win” attitude, the cheap shots, the sense of entitlement. That’s all the Pronger era Ducks.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
And that’s what he got when he went to the Ducks. He didn’t have that chip on his shoulder in STL.
I think forcing the Blues to trade him to EDM (to get Brewer, ironically) started his egotism. Anaheim just made it worse.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
@MikeCorcoranNHL Connolly replaces Jones. If Hall, Wyman, and Malone can’t go upfront tomorrow, still short up front, no? Just thinking out loud..
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Maybe Hall and Wyman are not that serious and we go with 11/7.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
Dunno. Haven’t heard anything about either of them. And only that Malone will try to skate today.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
“try to skate”—if that’s the wording and/or tone of the source info, that does not bode well for tomorrow night.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
That’s pretty much what I was reading yesterday. I haven’t heard anything yet today except Erlendsson tweeting that he expects Malone to play.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
erlendssontrib Erik Erlendsson
Yzerman says Adam Hall might be out for a while, pending further evaluation, Wyman not expeted to be out as long as Adam; both out tomorrow
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 4:50 PM EST up reply actions
Erik is thinking it might be Adam’s shoulder that was injured in the fight and not a concussion…but the Lightning haven’t announced anything beyond the vaguely familiar “upper body injury” statement.
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 5:12 PM EST up reply actions
Doncha know there are only 3 actual body parts that get injured: upper, middle, and lower.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
So…. where does hand/arm fit in? LOL
Does it depend on where the hand is in relation to the body? or is it considered an upper body if it’s upper arm or shoulder and lower body if it’s forearm or hand/wrist?
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:47 PM EST up reply actions
Its a lower body injury, I mean upper body, no lower body, wait—-would you be STILL!!!!
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
ROFL!
yep. About what I thought…
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:53 PM EST up reply actions
erlendssontrib Erik Erlendsson
Both Mikkelson and Connolly should be in the lineup Saturday; Malone skated today without incident, sounds like he could be ready to return
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
So it’s probably 11/7 with Mikkelson, Connolly and Malone replacing Wyman, Hall and Jones.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
erlendssontrib Erik Erlendsson
#tblightning have officially recalled Pierre-Cedric Labrie from @NorfolkAdmirals and reassigned D Evan Oberg; Labrie available to play Sat.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
No more Yo-Yo? Bummer. :-)
I further question the call-up. When I saw him in Norfolk last year, he was Downie-esque, with more discipline. If Downie and Malone are both playing, what’s the benefit? Color me curious.
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
Outside of Downs and Malone, there’s no one “tough” on the team. And Labrie is tougher than both. Also, next in line should probably be Trevor Smith, but he plays center and Labrie is a winger, something we need more right now.
Ashton and Conacher are wingers both Yzerman is not calling them up this season.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 6:46 PM EST up reply actions
Can’t call Conacher up until he signs NHL deal which won’t happen until the off season (unless something goes horribly wrong). He’ll stay in Norfork but he’s been told by Bolts mgt that they want to sign him next year.
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yep. And that’s good news, Conacher can be a huge steal.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 7:54 PM EST up reply actions
I agree. He’s tearing it up in Norfolk, been named to the AHL all star team. I think the kid has a ton of potential (that dreaded word..LOL) but I look forward to seeing what he can do in training camp next season.
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:55 PM EST up reply actions
He's also leading the AHL in Rookie Scoring
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
And I agree, Conacher and Ashton won’t (or shouldn’t) be called up this year, they can use the development time (Ashton can, anyway) in Norfolk where they will get plenty of playing time.
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
And on a totally off topic, but still hockey related subject...
The NHLPA refused to give the go-ahead for realignment so the current divisions/conferences will stay in place for the 2012-13 season.
I’m just wondering if this is reflective of the stance the NHLPA will take in the upcoming CBA talks and if it bodes well or ill for the talks. I really REALLY don’t want another lockout. The last one nearly destroyed the league and another one so soon after will have a bad effect on a lot of teams that are financially fragile already. Not a happy thought…
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
OK, so maybe “nearly destroyed the league” was a bit strong, but still, it’s taken the league how many years to recover?
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
The NHLPA sure loves their Tampa Bay Lightning, haha!
This CBA negotiation is shaping up to be a war, though.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 8:14 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, it is. And that’s a scary thought.
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
I think there’s a very real player issue with this: there is a structural advantage for some players over other to get into the playoffs. A team in a 7-team conference has a 7% greater chance to get into the playoffs than one in an 8-team conference, and that’s unfair from the get-go. From a player standpoint, that means that nearly half the players have a competitive advantage not only to win the Cup, but to get all those lovely playoff bonuses already written into contracts.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Not that I know what the real reason for this is, but I do think there’s something for players to be concerned about. I’m not jumping straight to the “Donald Fehr is playing games” side until I learn more.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Donald Fehr playing games?
Get used to it. This is just the start.
We will hear more of the same from here on out. Nothing more than positioning.
Expect to hear more from both sides leading up to the negotiations.
Unfortunately, I think you’re right. I remember the posturing (not going to call it positioning) in the last round of baseball negotiations when Fehr was MBLPA chief negotiator. The man is a power hungry bottom dwelling scum sucker. (and I’m being nice)
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
Posturing? Positioning?
Guess I’d call it one in the same. potato potodo…..
You have been nice in your description of Mr Fehr. The fact is, he’s been successful in past negotiations. I guess we know his answer when he was asked as a child….Do you want to be known as a good, middle class respectable person, or be a known as a wealthy, business successful, rat bastard. It’s clear he’s all business. In his mind, right and wrong are measured by the size of his bank account.
Now……..please don’t get me wrong. I have no problem with anyone having success. Quite frankly, I love to see it. I will never begrudge any successful person provided they did it right. Well, now we come down to morals and I think it’s time for me to stop.
It’s going to be an interesting summer. Let’s wait until then to discuss further. For now, let’s hope the Bolts can right the ship. The playoffs are still a possibility. However, that possibility is fading fast. Keep the faith! Always!!
I'm not ready to demonize anyone yet. (Although I've never been a baseball fan so I don't have that baggage.)
the NHLPA responded by communicating several concerns they had with the now-passed plan:
• The unbalanced conference format, with two divisions of eight teams and two divisions of seven teams. Combined with the return to a four-team “divisional” playoff format, the players felt there was an unfair advantage to teams in the smaller conferences.
Sure it’s negotiation tactics, but it’s way too early in the process to get this tense about it all. No need to borrow trouble. It’ll come along on its own soon enough.
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
And on it goes……….
You are correct, trouble will come soon enough. I’m just saying, expect more of the same over the last half of the season. This is just beginning.
Fair enough...
R.I.P. Belak, Rypien, Boogaard, Lokomotiv.
Rakastan suuria maalivahteja Skandinaviasta.
Love is but a song we sing And fear's the way we die.
Apparently Evan Oberg does exist
as he scored Norfolk’s 4th goal against the Albany Devils. Ads lead 4-0 after 2 with goals by Barberio, Ashton, Smith and Oberg. Tokarski has 26 saves.
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
But…..but….how do we know this is real? I mean, I know the score is, but has anybody actually SEEN this guy?
ROFL
"If you intend to kick a tiger in the ass, you damn well better have a plan in place for dealing with his teeth." Tom Clancy
by Tina Robinson on Jan 6, 2012 9:06 PM EST up reply actions
Ads let the Devils tie the game
Headed to overtime. Oh, Tik….
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 9:55 PM EST up reply actions
And the Devils win in OT. ¬¬
Following the Lightning from Rio Grande, Rio Grande do Sul, Brasil.
Let's. Go. BOLTS!
by Rafael Amarante on Jan 6, 2012 10:02 PM EST up reply actions
It's your fault, you know.
You were the one that mentioned they were up by four. :-)
"The Revolution will be complete when the language is perfect"
- Smith in Orwell's 1984
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